Am I A Glutten For Punishment ?

4 months ago

I've been in my current house for 22-23 years . The year I bought it , it was one of the most expensive sales in our larger city , and I was early 30's . A premium , architect designed house in one of the best locations .

This was my 7th house in 11 years , and I was early 30's .

A couple of years later , I spent quite a bit to do an update / renovation , and to suit my taste more . It was 18 years old at that stage . Some people said I was mad going from 6 bedrooms down to 5 , and from 3 bathroom/4 toilet up to 5 bath/6 toilet , but why not ?

Thats basically been it with a few tweaks . But I have done a few commercial buildings , from scratch or remodelled , and quite a few rental properties . I'm not a developer , not a 'flipper' .

My house has gone from being several hundred thousand worth , to several million now . I haven't thought about selling , for a variety of reasons -- it would be almost impossible to buy something else similar , especially in its location . Literally million dollar views , great house that suits me really well . It is within 3kms of 3 of my businesses .

Six months ago , I bought a commercial property that had basically been in the same ownership for 48 years , its on SH1 ( NZ's main top to bottom road ) , its on the corner of the street of one of my businesses , I just had a good feeling . I knew several other people would be interested , got the reports , and while its a mildly interesting story , basically I put in a 'once only best and final' offer , which is an unusual way of doing the real estate dance , but basically I went in probably $800k above where I would have normally started , and was 100% prepared to walk . In fact , I put a 48 hour time limit on my offer . The sellers agent tried to talk me up , will get back to me in a few weeks or months if no better offer , all the usual . I just sat there ( not literally ) , re-stated twice that was my money . At 47 hours , I got the expected phone call -- 'would you lose this for the sake of $200k' ? Yes . 30 minutes later -- 'Would 1 Dec suit for settlement ?' -- I got it !

So this was intended as my last development . Since then , a large multinational petrol company has taken a 20 year lease on part of the property ( they are paying good $$$$ , but they are doing all the work , and after 20 years will renew or re-instate or leave the building ) , a car franchaise wants me to do a build and leaseback , there is room to do all we need plus do around 30 industrial units or even 30 'live and work' units -- my architect has done some ideas with basements , 5 metre stud workshops , then 2 level of apartments above . Sure , it won't be plain sailing , but hey , that doesn't stop me haha .

Then , blow me down , I've now been offered another property , and I'm thinking seriously about it . It is a lifestyle block , 9kms from the edge of town , so 13/15kms to my businesses . 18 hectares , presently set up as mainly an equestrian property -- the stables and the railed paddock with sawdust , and the round paddock ( I think for 'breaking in' horses ) are no real use to me , but it has 3 large enclosed barns , essentially 3 entrances , heaps of space , and 'almost' an amazing house .

If I get it , I'll put up before and after photo's -- basically , it is 12 years old , primarily 2 storey , but a 3rd level in the steep roof has 2 more bedrooms each with a bathroom , and 5 more bedrooms and 4 bathrooms on the first level . Here's where it gets weird though -- they are in the middle of making about 3 of those bedrooms bigger , and including another bedroom ( so , yes , it will be 8 bedrooms ) by extending out over part of the ( 6 car plus workshop ) garage .

I'll get to the downstairs in a sec , but here's the weird bit -- it is up for sale because the current owners are both in prison ! They ( him and her ) are both accountants , and supposedly financial advisers , got in with presumably the horsey people and other influencial business people , lived like them , but ripped them off for well over $10 million ! The house is less than half that , but it all helps , they tried to have things in trusts etc , but anyway it is for sale .

Downstairs though is really where you have to see things -- the lounge is semicircular , with doors opening out to the pool and spa , 10 metres wide by 8 metres 'deep' , the entire curved and sloping roof ( its the only part of downstairs that doesn't have another floor above it ) is copper sheet !

Then theres , of course , the kitchen and butlers kitchen and basically a dining room , that goes right across the 10 metres . The dining room opens onto a glass conservatory , then that opens onto the tennis court .

But here's somethin g that is either weird or amazing , depending on your viewpoint -- there is a hallway ( no surprises there ) but there are 2 toilets/powder-rooms side by side , and the hallway is around 2 metres wide there . I guess for entertaining ? BUT beside them , but opening to the exterior ( not accessible to the inside ) is a 3rd toilet , and a shower and changing room , presumably for the pool and tennis courts . I asked , and when you lock the front doors ( yes , front entrance is double doors 2.8 metres tall ! ) this 'external' toilet electronically locks too !

Also downstairs is the formal dining room ( currently has a table with 6 chairs each side , and 1 top and bottom ) ; a Family room that opens to its own terrace ; the European laundry with its own external door ; a study ; an office which is 2 rooms ( 1 for receptionist ? ) ; a sewing room ; and a sauna .

Oh , and as well as the double doors opening into the marbled entry foyer ( with a marble 'fountain' thing that looks like a birdbath and basically is a medium dribble haha ) , yes , there is the grand staircase heading upstairs .

So all up , its nearly twice the size of my existing place ( and at 450 sq mtrs thats big enough ! ) and more upmarket I think , but that extra 18 hectares means we have heaps of options ( Council and neighbours willing ) -- storage or workshops for race cars ; work from home possibly ; have some cattle ; get a girlfriend with a horse haha ?

If I do get it , it will definitely be the last place I do . . . . . . .

Comments (9)

  • pottsy99
    Original Author
    4 months ago

    Yeah , to be honest that is one of the things that makes me hesitant . Might sound a bit weird , but right now the house is a bit of a mess ( they started alterations before the owners were arrested ) , the stables and post and rail and all that is absolutely no use to me , so even though they've spent a lot of $$$ , I'd spend more just maintaining them .

    Basically , I'll almost certainly add large workshops , but $$$ wise its better to start from scratch -- i ruled out trying to alter buildings real early on .

    And one potential downside is even these days any girlfriends I have tend to be mid-20's to mid 30's , a bit glamorous and often have a kid or two . So not only is having a nice house a 'bonus' , I don't want the added attraction and nagging about getting horses , or even the thought in the back of some females minds that in a couple of years half that could be theirs haha .

    I think you are in Aus now KiwiMills ? Here the lending rules changed a couple of months ago , so this property ( which realistically would take $250k just to get to the former livable standard , probably close to $700-800k to do the additions ) is now probably out of the lending criteria for any 'aspirational' family who have just sold a $2mil place -- the banks won't lend on anything that needs work ; won't lend on water egress issues ; won't lend to anyone 'taking a punt' and hoping for capital gain .

    Basically , I'm waiting for a few people to get back to me , but the more I talk and listen , the pool of people genuinely able to buy this is getting smaller and smaller , so is the amount I will tender . I will only buy it if I get it at 'my' price , more than happy to walk away . The Lincoln Street ( commercial ) property I bought was a bit of a 'unicorn' -- the right property in a very rare position that I had a definite use for -- this place is almost the reverse -- it has heaps of potential and a good base , but it won't matter one bit in the overall scheme if I miss it .

  • kiwimills
    4 months ago

    I was in whangarei, now chch... Not quite oz, but lived in syddddnneeey for many many years.

    (we r similar ages)

    Yes, I heard if u have a gym membership, no mortgage for u etc.

    Banks are nervous, due to the American banking collapse.. Again... That's probably about to happen.

    Look, if you can get it for a song and you can make it amazing for u, do it.

    If not, like u say, walk away.

    You can always rent the arena out for practice. Just don't house horses.

    Not even on behalf of others.

    Then it's easy.

    But if you get it, share some pics.

    pottsy99 thanked kiwimills
  • pottsy99
    Original Author
    4 months ago

    Definitely won't get it for a song , its still several mil , plus another mil or so to finish the alterations , but I would probably add half that again , because the interior is essentially finished to a European standard , but the exterior is a bit 'American' -- big , slightly crass , missing a bit of refinement . In a house of that standard , I'd want to add some native timber , some schist , just make the exterior a bit more refined .

    The land is a bonus -- some calves or sheep , the closed in sheds can be used for storing cars or container loads of parts , I'd like to build a big workshop that can take a truck and trailer , bus or mobile home ( or 2 or 3 ) , and work on them , paint them etc . As long as its not full time commercial its allowed .

  • kiwimills
    4 months ago

    Well, not a one off Rick Ashley song, but at a price that will give you the instant equity you want and the land to do what you need to do.

    If they won't accept, it was never meant to be yours anyway and you will find something even better.

    Exciting project though.

    Looking forward to seeing orange doors and yellow window frames and blue steps....

    pottsy99 thanked kiwimills
  • pottsy99
    Original Author
    4 months ago

    Ummm , its already my favourite colour haha .

    That is about half the length by the way , but some is the '6' car garage which is actually around 30mtrs x 18 mtrs deep !

  • kiwimills
    4 months ago


    Just FYI.
    Copy and paste your first post, then change your settings to Australia and paste/ post in that forum.
    In the NZ forum we see both countries chit chat, but oz does not see ours...if you want more opinions that is.
    As its not showing in the oz forum.

    But you may only want my opinion..lol

    You have to start a fresh topic, then change country back to NZ, and you will see both threads...
    So you can reply via NZ country forum..
    We see more topics than they do, as we see NZ ones as well.
    There aren't many to be fair!

  • pottsy99
    Original Author
    4 months ago

    Without looking it up , the new Credit Regulations came in on 1 Dec , and there is a fine of up to $200,000 for every instance of 'irresponsible lending' . The problem seems to be that it isn't defined .

    So a couple who have been together for 5 years , saved $100k , both on $100k plus , have $50k of cars that they are prepared to sell and drive $5k ones , plus 1 lot of parents has $50k to lend them . A house that is $1million they can afford . But what if the female gets pregnant ? What if he loses his job and takes 2 months to get a $50k job ? What if the parent dies and the lawyer wants the $50k back ( or $37.5k of it to distribute to other siblings ) ?

    Those clothes trucks that go around the lower income suburbs sell a pair of 'knock-off' designer jeans to a solo mum for her 14 year old daughter . They charge $5 a week for 20 weeks , mum and daughter are happy because it fits their budget . You and I can probably find them on-line for $40 , they might be able to too , but to get $40 might mean missing a couple of meals or not prepaying the power , so they don't .

    I am a director of more than 40 companies . Probably half of them I own 99% of shares , others I own 33% or 40% or 50% . Pre-Covid , combined turnover was well over $250k a day , my property holdings are well into 8 figures .

    In June/July when I bought the Lincoln Street property , the mortgage was almost a formality -- I've dealt with the same bank for 35 or more years , have good cashflow and own a reasonable whack of my properties . Almost all have mortgages , and the more valuable ones also have floating charges , but I doubt I am classed as a risky borrower .

    Tenders close on this place in just under a month , but as it is technically not livable ( a couple of walls have been taken out and additions started -- they have closed it in with building paper and ply and wrap ) , I cannot get a mortgage , even though my intention is make it better , spend up to $1.5mil , and live there for at least 15 years ( I will have turned 70 by then haha ) .

    So if I do get it , rather than a approx 3.5% mortgage , I will have to get it via Bridging Finance ( at 11% ) , then after a year or 18 months , when everything is complete and Lake Crescent ( my current place ) is hopefully sold , and hopefully the rules have been clarified , I then go the through process of getting registered valuations and applying for a mortgage etc . Assuming Lake Cres sells for around what everything thinks , even after spending $1.5M on alterations , the mortgage should be under $2M and valuation likely to be around $7.5M ( land and stables etc will make up about half that ) , but right now its harder to get that than it was to get funding for Lincoln Street , which depending on exactly how it all pans out , will be $15M plus when complete .

    Interesting couple of months .

    This is a picture taken from a spot towards the rear of the property -- a bit clearer than the other ones .

  • kiwimills
    4 months ago

    Dallas in NZ

    Looks great!
    Sounds like you know what u r doing, and soooo busy!!!
    U must have fingers in all the pies. Well done.

    Well, I hope this becomes another piece of a pie, as it sounds like u r quite keen to fix it up

    I'm thinking, u r getting a little emotionally attached....

    All the best !!