jeanjeanremodelmachine

Is proper lighting the secret sauce for mixing warm and cool colors?

Mittens Cat
4 years ago
last modified: 4 years ago

We are finalizing both our lighting plan and our new kitchen cabinets and I'd love some input from people who really understand the effect different kinds of lighting, especially in regard to bringing out warm tones or cool tones (or all that sort of stuff I have very little knowledge about).

I was going to go with a very light stain on our walnut veneer cabinets, just enough to bring out the warmth. But in trying to choose a countertop, I discovered I'm not thrilled with "warm" whites (anything with yellow or brown in it). The countertops I fall for are typically much cooler. So, now I'm trying to gear up to switch to no stain (just clear coat) on the walnut cabinets, which leaves them a bit colder than I wanted but at least they'll look good with a cooler toned counter and backsplash.

Then I realized: maybe LIGHTING is the secret sauce in all this. I hate glare and bright lights, so I was going to try to stick to under 3,000K, but maybe there's something else that can be done, lighting-wise, to help the warms and cools blend together better? And fwiw, we are aiming for a contemporary look and already installed plenty of frames for overhead recessed lights.

I've discussed this on another thread (someone else's thread, I think) but thought I'd start anew. Especially since I see a lot of posts from people concerned about mixing creamy whites with bright whites. Thanks for your help!

Comments (28)

  • PRO
    Anglophilia
    4 years ago

    We need pictures. Are these new cabinets or existing ones?

  • cpartist
    4 years ago

    Mitten's yes the lighting can absolutely make a difference and anything under 3000k is going to make the whites and other colors feel warmer.

  • acm
    4 years ago

    But also, dark walnut cabinets and light counters (without yellow) are already great together, so you may be overthinking this and may want to choose lighting tone by what light you like to use to work, rather than trying to create some illusions of color...


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  • Pam A
    4 years ago

    It is also possible to get led lights that are selectable color temp. I have them for all my 4" recessed lighting and changing the color is a bit annoying (pull the light, move a selector switch) but it helped SO much when I was trying to balance warm and cool colors in the same space. At one point I had half the kitchen as 3500k and half as 3000k. Our under cabinet lights are Lifx, and selectable as well (those are at 4000k).


    The light colors brought out different tones in our cabinets, I think I saw more of an impact to how the wood looked than how the stone looked, if that helps at all.

    Mittens Cat thanked Pam A
  • User
    4 years ago

    Lighting will never compensate to make clashing colors work together. It can help modify one specific element, occasionally. Like a backsplash.

  • Sammy
    4 years ago

    acm is spot-on. There’ll be no problem with your warm walnut stain and white countertops. I don’t know how or when the notion that mixing cools and warms is a bad thing. I think one “pro” said it, which gave it credence, and then it spread like wildfire.

  • acm
    4 years ago

    well, warm and cool grays clash, as do warm and cool tans. so that's where the discussion starts. but dark brown goes with white just as well as navy blue does -- it's all contrast of classics.

  • PRO
    JAN MOYER
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Wellllll.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,what the heck is your flooring as that is a far larger issue than the temperature of recessed lighting when selecting a counter top.Your back splash is the least of the issue, and a non issue for now.It is best selected after tops are in place.

    Mittens Cat thanked JAN MOYER
  • Sammy
    4 years ago

    well, warm and cool grays clash, as do warm and cool tans.

    I thought that went without saying, acm...which is why I didn’t say it! ;) My comment was aimed at trying to dispel the (nonsense) notion that it’s never okay to mix warms and cools.


    Mittens Cat thanked Sammy
  • Sammy
    4 years ago

    At one point I had half the kitchen as 3500k and half as 3000k. Our under cabinet lights are Lifx, and selectable as well (those are at 4000k).

    I’d love to see those Lifx lights in action, Pam A. Could you post some pics?

    Mittens Cat thanked Sammy
  • PRO
    Patricia Colwell Consulting
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    IMO the best LEDs are in the 3500-5000k range and I find most of my clients like the 4000K it mimics daylight and makes choosing colors so much easier since they stay true at night. As for walnut and white they are a perfect pairing and IMO the best . I lke walnut left in its natural state but that is just me. I do agree that this is a decision that needs more info to get answers like the flooring for sure.

    Mittens Cat thanked Patricia Colwell Consulting
  • Mittens Cat
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    @JAN MOYER, thanks, our floors will be a warm, light honey color, mostly likely Kahrs Ash Kalmar, mostly because I'm trying to closely match the 1,000 sq feet of Junckers Ash Harmony we have left over from original (it's still in good shape and we plan to use for closets, laundry room and other less showy areas).


    And yes, I have definitely learned from Houzzers to wait on backsplash! Smart idea!


    To @acm and others who suggested white counters, that was our original plan and at this point it's probably the leading contender. But after falling in love with so many gorgeous slabs of quartzite, granite, etc. I realized maybe choosing a plain white counter was "settling" (white being so vanilla) and maybe I should be a bit more brave and go with some color, as long as I keep it bright (since those walnut cabs are going to suck in a lot of light). But every slab I was attracted to seemed to have cooler colors, mainly blue. Thus, this (First World Problem) conundrum...

  • Mittens Cat
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    @Patricia Colwell Consulting, thanks. I've been thinking the smart move is just to stick with my original walnut + white plan, then sprinkle in some colorful quartzite fun, maybe above the sink (where I'll have no window, sob) or elsewhere. I really don't need a huge chunk of it to satisfy my stone lust. :)

    I was also getting big eyes over these 3'x'3' remnants and thinking perhaps a selection of these colorful squares would be just the thing for...patio? stepping stones? really heavy end tables? a whole bunch of coasters? Or maybe slice them into rectangles and mount them, collage style, onto a side of fireplace? (see bottom below)




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  • 2ManyDiversions
    4 years ago

    Mittens Cat it took me this long to find this post again... sorry! I do like your creative ideas to so something with those remnants!

    FWIW, DH installed color select leds in our utility room first time... set them to 3000K to see if my eyes could tolerate them (I have eye issues), and I could not. He climbed back in the attic, and after some cursing, set them to 2700K. They were not 2700K but rather a dimmer 5000K. I know this because once you pass 2700K the lights start moving from yellowish, which my eyes won't tolerate (sadly). I also know this because we had 2700k in the kitchen and I could easily see the color temperature difference. I think 3000k is a nice medium (which sadly I can't take).

    With the various kelvins, you have warm whites, cool whites (in between) and daylights.

    Perhaps there are color select leds that produce true kelvins, but those that we first installed did not. Dimmer does not mean color temperature change, it just means a dimmer version of that color temperature. DH had to remove those cans and put in true 2700 for me.

    Also FWIW, I love a well-lit kitchen, despite eye issues. We just put in more 2700k lights to solve my problem.

    Mittens Cat thanked 2ManyDiversions
  • 2ManyDiversions
    4 years ago

    Pam, my DH clearly picked the wrong temperature change puck lights - those actually change the color temperature... Nice!!

    Those are under counter lights, right? Which ones are those of the LIFX? Link, please : )

  • msmliss
    4 years ago

    Thanks, Pam! : ) I've learned something about lighting with your sample photo! 3200K is perfect "natural" and workable for me!

  • Mittens Cat
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    @Pam A, very interesting side by side by up/down comparison! So are these the same bulbs but they're able to change their color (if so, I'm wondering why the company didn't call them Chameleons instead!). Or is this a series of photos comparing different bulbs? Thanks

  • User
    4 years ago

    Tunable lights are only an aftermarket substitute for not involving a good lighting designer up front. You really never need to have your lights change color if you select the right lights in the first place. Unless you are talking about RBG light colors for a part atmosphere?


    Tweaking light colors in under cabinet can help mask a backsplash mistake. It’s far better to just not make those mistakes on the front end. A good designer is far cheaper than attempting to fix mistakes.

  • PRO
    Galilee Lighting
    4 years ago

    I like the 3000K led it is a very natural lightly warm color that doesn't control the atmosphere and the wall color

    Mittens Cat thanked Galilee Lighting
  • Lynn G
    4 years ago

    There's nothing like warm incandescent light. I'm hoping Trump will legalize it again. Until then, try to find ways to have warm light. I have had a few ceiling fans in recent years with LED lights in them and I rarely ever turn them on - the light is so bad/unpleasant.


    I bought some bulbs for already-existing inset/can lighting. I was told what ones to buy from the electrician. It has a sort of green shade to them. Looking forward to them burning out and replacing them. So those are not all the same so be careful which ones you buy if you have those...


    Personally, one of my favorite things to have in my kitchen is an old fashioned, vintage small lamp that can emit a warm glow in my kitchen when I don't need bright task lighting.

    Mittens Cat thanked Lynn G
  • iheartsix
    4 years ago

    Following ...

  • Pam A
    4 years ago

    Sorry for the delay! The strips we used are Lifx Z Strips. We got the aluminum mounting channels on Amazon. We cut them with a hacksaw. The Lifx strips fit right into the channels, but they come an adhesive mount if you think the mounting channel looks like a pain.


    https://www.amazon.com/LIFX-Adjustable-Multicolor-Dimmable-Assistant/dp/B073168F4Y/ref=asc_df_B073168F4Y/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=216527863848&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11001182348766562939&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=t&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9001883&hvtargid=pla-446460198647&psc=1


    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F9RTII4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1


    With all due respect to LWO ... if you have two different brands of lighting for your overhead and undercabinet lighting, being able to tune one to match the other is an extremely useful feature. I have not found that there is a whole lot of consistency between what one company calls 3500k and another calls 3500k. And even being just 10% off the nominal value would be noticeable to me. 3150 vs 3850 is something you can see. My ceiling lights run cool compared to LifX, so the best match was to put ceilings at 3500 and Lifx at 4000.


    And hey, for holidays you can ABSOLUTELY go nuts with color schemes :)

  • Mittens Cat
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    @Lynn G, I'm so with you. When I finally realized that incandescent was truly leaving us, I wanted to cry! Or at least buy a ton of them and horde them! The bright side: at least we're beyond the horrible compact fluorescents!

  • 2ManyDiversions
    4 years ago

    Incandescent... aw. Fully agree with Lynn and Mittens Cat, I loved them, still love them, always will. I am finding 2700 K to be agreeable, and similar enough that I don't freak out when I walk into a room, LOL! I've accidentally purchased too-strong kelvins, or worse yet, those horrific fluorescent tube bulbs which have the blue light (which always reminds me of the movie Joe VS the Volcano and the office scene with those hideous fluorescent lights that seemed to suck the life out of everything and everyone : D

    All the houses in the distance behind us have either very old incandescent lights throughout, or 2700 to 3000 K.... Except one. I think not understanding lighting, they got 5000K (is there anything higher?!), and I am not exaggerating, on warm summer evenings, sitting on my screened porch, my eyes scan across the distance, it's relaxing to see that lovely warm glow, then I am jarred by what is someone's living room or kitchen that looks like aliens have just landed. But, to each their own.

  • 2ManyDiversions
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Pam A, your post didn't show up until just now (for me!). Thank you for the links and info. Question: Are these dependent on an app to change color temperature?

    The only info I can find (for now) is they are not compatible with hardware dimmer switches, which is the only thing I wish to use to dim them, and I do want them dimmable. Darn.

    I try to avoid, as much as I can, anything dependent on apps. Apps can go bad or become outdated.

    I do have to say, these are awesome LED strips, with a variety of applications : ) I can't imagine myself changing the lights beyond what I want, except maybe once briefly just to see what it looks like, haha! And also with respect to LWO, I can't imagine myself hiring a lighting designer for my kitchen lighting. Maybe if I owned a theater, though.

  • Pam A
    4 years ago

    Yes, you ARE dependent on an app to change color and dim them. They do respond to on and off (turn it off and back on, it goes to the same color and brightness it was at when it was turned off). You cannot dim them with a dimmer switch, sadly.


    Ours are set up to turn on when a motion sensor is tripped and they go to full bright. We also have Google Home so I can say, "OK Google, turn off the kitchen lights".


    I don't know of a solution that does not require an app for undercabinet lights, sadly.

  • 2ManyDiversions
    4 years ago

    Thank you for getting back to me so quickly Pam. Your link to the LED channels on Amazon is also very helpful!

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